Am from Italy, italians are the whitest of the whites. Rome, the church, the basis of modern Patriarchy and white supremacy was born and raised here folks
I’m from Italy as well. I always like to remember a quote from Charles Mingus, who at some point in his career had an entire black band with the exception of his sax player, Charlie Mariano. When asked about it, he answered something along of the lines of “He’s not white, he’s Italian.”
yea, its because the Italians (and Irish, Chinese, etc as well) generally came to America later and were poorer than the British/French/Germans etc were, so they were often discriminated against (plus the mafia thing, but that also generally comes from being poorer)
What I meant is simply that the roman empire and the Catholic church forged ideological colonial basis of today, not that racism didn’t exist before
Also I meant Patriarchy as an overarching colonial institution, not as an isolated cultural concept. The world wasn’t always universally like this, there are many examples of non (or less) patriarchal societies throughout history, and we don’t know enough about prehistory to make any definitive judgement on humanity
I wonder if this is partially a north/south italy divide thing (I don’t know all that much about Italy but I have heard the north was generally more privileged)
I don’t know about the north, but the places my family are from are not 5 star cities, especially my dads mom. her town is super small and is very poor.
my moms house she grew up here, had a whole thing for my grandfather to raise rabbits he would kill for the family to eat. I think someone complained about it or it wasn’t legal to do anymore or somthing so he stopped doing it.
Am from Italy, italians are the whitest of the whites. Rome, the church, the basis of modern Patriarchy and white supremacy was born and raised here folks
I’m from Italy as well. I always like to remember a quote from Charles Mingus, who at some point in his career had an entire black band with the exception of his sax player, Charlie Mariano. When asked about it, he answered something along of the lines of “He’s not white, he’s Italian.”
Maybe the social meaning of ethnicity is really relative to the racist empires they’re situated in and not on some sort of inherent value
yea, its because the Italians (and Irish, Chinese, etc as well) generally came to America later and were poorer than the British/French/Germans etc were, so they were often discriminated against (plus the mafia thing, but that also generally comes from being poorer)
So pagans weren’t white?
The Norse?
What a weird definition you use
What I meant is simply that the roman empire and the Catholic church forged ideological colonial basis of today, not that racism didn’t exist before
Also I meant Patriarchy as an overarching colonial institution, not as an isolated cultural concept. The world wasn’t always universally like this, there are many examples of non (or less) patriarchal societies throughout history, and we don’t know enough about prehistory to make any definitive judgement on humanity
True but that doesn’t fit with your argument as a precondition to being white
Whiteness as we know it was mad there
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i disagree
I wonder if this is partially a north/south italy divide thing (I don’t know all that much about Italy but I have heard the north was generally more privileged)
I don’t know about the north, but the places my family are from are not 5 star cities, especially my dads mom. her town is super small and is very poor.
I am told that where my italian great grandmother lived it was fairly normal to keep a goat in the house (like, indoors) for financial reasons
interesting to me as I have never heard of that being a thing in the U.S.
my moms house she grew up here, had a whole thing for my grandfather to raise rabbits he would kill for the family to eat. I think someone complained about it or it wasn’t legal to do anymore or somthing so he stopped doing it.